OccupySacto.org

OK, if this is not dead space let's talk turkey? Why was the discussion on the port of Sacramento killed? Why do the same issues come up every night at GA? Why are new ideas killed before they can be explored? Why don't I feel part of a movement I support? Why are we picking on each other?

I, personally, have a very hard time at the GA's because it's after an 8 hour workday and I am starving. =(

I have the hardest time even keeping up with the discussion. And I feel like everybody is a bit grouchy. Some because of the cold and hunger. Some because they believe their voices aren't being heard. And others because of the horrible GA's that have occurred before.

Really, I think the problem is the environment that the GA occurs in; Tiffany does an amazing job imho. And the lack of open forum that occurs. There is now a perception that the GA is the ONLY place where things can be said. The fallacy here is that the body does not need to be addressed, nor is it even possible at GA, at the spark of every idea. And that the GA is not the place to flush out ideas.

Now, to address my believed fallacy. There needs to be a "Idea Safe Zone" for real discussion. The other issue, which is being addressed right now and will probably be posted on the forums, is the collection of contact information for the various groups that currently exist.

I agree with both of your concerns. I personally am a second generation internet baby, since 1996, I've done all forms of discussion and think-tanking threw forums such as this. Unfortunately, there is a large gap between the socio-economic backgrounds in the supposed "information age".

I believe that threw a multi-phased forum re-structuring we can achieve the "freedom of ideas" that we all dream of. I am personally failing Occupy Sacramento in regards to proposing the few small organization things that we can do to make this place a vibrant idea ecosystem.

In the next few days, I'll attempt to bring forward some ideas and practices for here that can 'help' achieve a thriving forums idea atmosphere.

Outside of the internet I believe certain people will always feel excluded, or under-heard, it is a human nature problem that we can do more than constant fight against.


What are some ideas that you feel can help us achieve a more utopian idea?





(in regards to the port, we were understaffed, and most of the companies and people we would be hurting are local and struggling already. Sacramento isn't the multi-billion dollar port industry that exists on the coast. I was a strong proponent against a local port shutdown, we have, imho, bigger fister-fry.)

I think you all know that I agree!! There is very little room for discussion at GAs, and committees are divided up, so nobody is really looking at the big picture. I've been proposing a new "Policy &Planning cmte to address the overall big picture stuff, and have one fellow volunteer already, just need one more...

The idea is that the P&P cmte would meet in person, and also take input from people who post on this board. Basically the serious discussion will happen here.

Absolutely agree with sentiments expressed here - It's not easy doing things the way we would like to do them (know they can be done) when we've lived so long under such oppression - even from communicating with one another. It will take time, and we must be patient and understanding.

Nathan - your 'Policy & Planning' Committee sounds much like my "Foundational Processes" - is it? If so, you can count me in - I'll contribute what I can (you've seen my screed, so you can also say 'no-thanx, red' - i don't mind at all). I do think you will have to create the Committee by describing/defining it and presenting it as a motion to GA. This, I found out the hard way, is a difference between 'committees' and 'workgroups' - and any group dealing with fundamental processes, strategic decisions and such is almost certainly going to need to be a 'Committee' under our definitions. Also think you will need to see if you can pull several other functions inside it, ones that were originally split into separate committees - like 'Resolutions', and 'By-Laws'. Certainly, anything dealing in basic policy and planning should also be working on those items. Don't know if those groups still exist or what their status is, but it would be a natural to have them as subcommittees. Good luck on that effort - hope you make some headway.

2. On the internet thing - I completely agree that Occupy is not just a park presence, as important as that is. A virtual occupy zone can shatter the need to do a whole bunch of things that we have done so clumsily on the ground. But that system does not exist at the moment. We have this BB and LiveStream, and its totally inadequate (without detracting one whit from the enormous effort the media team has put into it and how valuable it has been. But what we really need is something quite spectacularly different - a real representation of occupation as a virtual reality. There is much on line that does some of that (streams, chats, blogs...), but nothing that brings all the functions of what an individual occupy zone needs to do into a single, easy-to-occupy and use, comprehensive support platform. That's the ideal. Can we get there?

I think so. I tried to assemble a team of technical people to begin work on designing and creating it. But couldn't quite do it. What happened mostly was that I felt it depended on coordination with media team and others (Ricky, Russell, etc.) - at least to the point of giving the effort it's blessing and providing them with the keys to the kingdom (passwords, permissions, access to our present setup - on the ground and here). Maybe I was wrong about that - maybe they could just go and build our new zone and then offer it as a completed work that we can transfer our operations to? I don't know. I do know that the first step is to assemble a team of really good, experienced and imaginative technical people - occupy geeks - to consider the matter and begin design work and talking among themselves and a few of us who can serve as the 'client' input side of the project. I figured it would take about 5 such people to begin such a project (more as it goes - but that would be their concern). I still think I can muster 1 or 2 from that attempt who would still be interested. Can any of you provide/find more people? Keep in mind, they've got to be good, trustworthy, and know their stuff. If you know and contact people who are interested, let me know - with contact addys - by private message and I will consider re-activating the project. Ambitious, yes. But if occupy is going for the long-haul, why not see if we can give it a vehicle that will help get it there? - fishwrap or food-for-thought.

Thanks Red, yes I will post about the P&P idea soon, in a new thread. And yes it would be great to have your help! I think you hit on one important thing too: Figuring out which committees/workgroups still exist, and who the contact persons are. It seems like OS is more in need of help than most people realize, and they were actually asking for someone to volunteer to figure out the cmtes/workgroups, who the contacts are, which exist still, and when they meet. Think you'd be able to help with this Red?

If that got done, it would put us in a good position to propose new cmtes, or take over abandoned ones...

On the virtual occupation idea, it sounds good, but definitely well beyond what OS is capable of right now. Does secondlife have any of the features you're talking about? Or is there a place to connect with occupiers from other areas, to make it a larger effort?

Ok, one final thought, OS really is in need of help with the basics right now. After assessing things, I realized that the equipment is disorganized and hard to access, which is hampering occupation activities. So my winter break projects involve putting a roof and some locks on the trailer, and building a rolling wooden cart for the "occu-kitchen". Next steps involve a better power system and a cart for the media group. Gotta re-build the foundation so to speak.

Nathan - you're doing yeoman's work. Given your own agenda, I can see you are going to need help. I do hope your activity and addy is being passed around and that people will offer to help on your projects.

- on the groups/committees and contact lists - I have more trouble finding out who is who and how to contact than most. I think this is really a job for one of the facilitators or key core group people who know all this or can easily get the info. I tried to put a fire under some of them to get this done and post a groups/contact list. Maybe you can put a bug in someone's ear? Actually each committee/group needs a separate forum where they post their contact stuff, events calendar, project info and other material. They'd probably also recruit new help by doing that.

- I don't know about 'secondlife' . My thought is that a virtual occupation platform just needs a good technical team to make it so - and that it would be nice if the pilot platform used Oc Sac as its model. It also requires some coordination with people handling the current platforms (we have already recognized our virtual members as full citizens, just don't have the virtual reality for them). But I have no regional contacts at all in that arena (indeed, I'm one of the most technically challenged people I know). About all I can do is put out the call and see who shows up, as I have done. So far, nobody.

Yes, I'm not working alone, there are others helping for sure!

I think the point is that "putting a fire" under somebody at OS isn't going to accomplish anything, because they're already burnt out

People need to take on whatever tasks we want to see done